Ashley Graham, Tess Holiday, Are All Bodies Beautiful? with Arteluna Miami - PINNED Podcast: Episode 43

This week we have Vivian joining us to take a deep dive into body positivity through stars& influencers such as Ashley Graham, Tess Holliday, Rebel Wilson, Adele, and even Eugenia Cooney! This episode will have a follow up so please send in your views in the comments! 


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About  Vivian

Cuban-American artist Vivian Estalella was born and raised in Miami, Florida in a family of strong independent women. As a little girl, she never played with dolls or toys. Instead, she preferred to spend her time coloring. She was always happier with a box of crayons or paints than a Barbie doll. Always creative, she enjoyed the arts from a very young age. At the age of 15, a trip to Mexico awakened her passion for painting. The intensely rich colors of Mexican art struck a cord and, together with her Cuban roots, formed a style that is both distinctive and uniquely vibrant. The sights, sounds, exotic tastes, and passionate people of the tropics, along with the sensuous female form, are all prevalent in her work

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Transcript

Miss Pinup Miami: 0:06

Good day and welcome back to the pin podcast. We're on episode number 43. And here at the pin podcast, we talk about modern topics with a vintage flair. I'm your host Pinup Miami. If your first time listening, welcome, I hope you will stick around and enjoy all the topics that I have to offer. And if you're a returning listener, I want to say thank you so much for the support. It means so much for me so much to me. I couldn't do this without you guys. And I don't have any words, but just to remind you every week how thankful I am to have you here. Make sure that if you haven't followed us at the on Instagram, check out pin podcast official on Instagram, or send me a text I get him directly. And you can ask me any questions any topics you want to hear, especially for this episode, because there's going to be a follow up episode of Part Two to this episode. So text any questions, comments concerns directly to me at 18334 a pinup. Before I get into today's episode, I just want to talk about today's sponsor, we have Valeo rock and roll concert that's going to be April 16, at 9pm here in South Florida and follow us on coyotes in coyotes, those of you familiar with South Florida, you know, kioto I'm sure my guest knows kioto if you play dominoes, you know, okay. So we have, um, Daniel rock and roll concert, which is a tribute to the music, legends of the 1950s and 60s. So you're going to hear all the great hits from that era, there's even going to be an opening act by a Motown tribute band. So that's going to be exciting. And the most exciting part is I am one of the CO hosts for the night. So make sure to come out. It's only $25. But with a promo code that I have, you get $5 off so you only pay $20. And the cool thing about this promo code is that you don't need to have a guest usually for this show, you need to reserve a table. But if you use my promo code, you get to sit in the cool kids table with any all the pinups and all the rocket movie lovers here in South Florida. Using promo code Pinup Miami with a capital P capital U and a capital M, I put it down in the show notes below, you get $5 off and you get to sit at a table. So don't worry if you don't have a date, because you get to sit with like minded individuals that are super cool. So make sure to check that out. I have the link down below. You don't want to miss it out. miss out. Today, like I said, a little preview before. Today's episode is gonna be very interesting controversial for a few. Um, but it's really a topic that I've had in my mind for a while. And it's going to be an intense conversation that I want to get you guys the listeners input. So that's why there'll be a second part to this episode. For this episode, I have Vivian you know her she's been here before, I guess officially she's a co host because she's been here a number of times. I can't get rid of me. I can. And her Instagram handle is edited Luna Miami, she also made some beautiful hair flowers. If you're watching on YouTube, after you'd like and subscribe, make sure to check out her YouTube editor Luna millenary she makes beautiful flowers. But today's episode and it's gonna be about being plus size is all bodies beautiful, you know, and how it's seen in the media in the world and influencers. Like there's so many things under this topic, but we're gonna touch over a few. We want to see what you guys have to say. So make sure to keep this a conversation and let us know in the comments below what you think, or ideas that you have. So, Vivian, we're both you know, I can speak for both of us. We're both plus size women. Yeah. To us, maybe I can speak for myself, but you know, medically obese. So yeah, I'm pretty safe. So and if I don't know how else to put it. So I wanted to talk about today about a few topics. So I've heard the statement all bodies are beautiful. And I've heard the statement that all bodies are healthy bodies. So I'm wanting to break this down. Like do you agree that all bodies are beautiful?

Vivian: 4:55

I do agree that all bodies are beautiful. Like there's beauty and everything you know, and every One is the way they are. That's how you were born. That's how you are how you exist. And of course, there's beauty in that, you know, and it's like they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But I think you can find beauty everywhere. So absolutely, there's, you know, all bodies are beautiful. I agree. And how about our bodies are healthy, all bodies are healthy bodies. I don't know if you ever heard this mantra? Well, that's a little more controversial. I believe that you can be fat and be healthy. Absolutely. I've always been a very healthy fat person. I've never had diabetes, I haven't had you know, high cholesterol, I haven't had any issues. After I turned 40, I had started having high blood pressure, but that's it's maintained, you know, I have it under control and everything's okay. But other than that, I've always been a very healthy person, and I've been overweight my entire life. So you can be overweight and be healthy. But that's a very personal thing. You know, there are people who are overweight or not healthy, but at the same time, there's a lot of thin people that are not healthy, too. So I don't think health is, you know, directly correlated to the way that but um, it can be I mean, it just depends. See, I agree and disagree.

Unknown: 6:20

Bring it on, bring it on. Yeah, this episode, I really have been thinking about this topic. Yes. Cheers. I've never been a Starbucks fan until take the talk, because I love the words Barbies. And then I don't know, just people. I've had this idea in my head that like, Yes, I like yourself. I've always been a bigger girl. I mean, I'm a twin and my twin has always been skinny. I've always been bigger. Um, let me I'm just gonna come on and say it. I'm always on the fence. Because I know that I could be healthier if I was thinner, not super thin, but like just a couple of pounds. Um, I've done runway walks. But then I've also seen girls bigger than me do a one way walk, but it feels like they're hurting their knees because they're not walking correctly. Um, I feel like it's a thin line between being healthy. And being, you know, fat. Let me see if I'm translating this. Well, I agree. Can I be healthier? Yes, absolutely. But for the most part, I want to sample I was about 40. I'm 44. Now, but until I turn 48, I never had any health issues I really didn't. And around that time is when I started having high blood pressure. But before then I never had anything I have my you know, normal sugar, normal cholesterol, things that are normally attributed to, you know, being overweight. I never had an issue with but can I be healthier? Yes, absolutely. I get tired. You know, when I do things and, you know, I might get out of breath going up a flight of stairs and things like that. So of course, I could be healthier. But I don't think that it's always like, you shouldn't just if you see an overweight person at the mall or wherever, just assume that they're an unhealthy person. Because you don't know what that person's background is. Or, you know, that's what I meant by that. Have you ever had a doctor's I've seen I've had other girls tell me that they go to the doctor and before the doctor even diagnosis them, they already say Oh, I know what the issue is because you're you're you're fat, you need to lose weight, you're morbidly obese. Do you think that's ever happened to you? Yes, that's happened to me a lot. Um, thankfully, like you, Oh, um, you have to advocate for yourself. And it's not, there's a million doctors out there. Right. So if you go to a doctor that doesn't listen to you, or you don't feel heard by this person, or respected by this doctor, it's very simple to just leave and find another doctor. You know, there's there will be someone where you have a good fit with. I also believe in chemistry, if you go to a doctor, you don't have chemistry with a doctor, it's very hard to kind of build that relationship or those will there sit down and like actually listen to you and, you know, give time to all your concerns and all of that. So I need to find a doctor and chemistry in a day. Well, my dad always makes fun of me and tells me like that all my doctors are friends of mine. And it's it's kind of true. Like, I'm friends with good dentist, I'm friends. You know, with my personality. I just feel like you have to have like they don't have to be your close friend, but just have a comfort level with that person where you're able to sit down and have a conversation about your concerns. You know, So, because I have had doctors in the past where you go, and they don't listen to you, and they're just like, they attribute everything to me being fat. And so, you know, nothing is a big deal. And that's, that's not fun. That's not okay. And how do you feel about influence? Like, for example, a big influencer, or the first Sports Illustrated model was Ashley Graham. Right? Would you consider her a plus size model? Well, by today's standards, she's a plus size model. So I consider her plus size. No. I mean, she's gorgeous. I would, you know, I would love to have her figure, you know, I don't consider her plus size. But, you know, by Senate, I don't think she's large enough to be I will consider her like mid size. You know, she's not skinny, she's not big. She's like a mid size model. But by beauty standard shares plus size, because I think anything over like a size 10 is considered plus size for the media. So but she has done a lot, I think in terms of body positivity and loving yourself and kind of, you know, bringing light to, you know, inclusivity and having more plus size model on the runways. I think she's done a lot in that in that area. Do you feel like she's a good role model? Because I really like what you just said is why I like Ashley Graham. Yeah, she's a plus size girl, but she advocates health. You know, body positivity, not just enforcing the other stigma that we were talking about. All bodies are healthy, she mostly promoted, at least in my eyes. She promotes a healthy lifestyle. She just happens to be, you know, curvy. Right? Well, you know, like I said, I've been big my entire life, if you see my baby pictures, I came out of the womb, like a chubby girl. But, um, there's more to me than just that, you know. So when I meet somebody, I don't want them to like me, because I'm fat. There's more to me than that, you know, that's just one of the things and I, of course, would love people to accept me for being larger because I am, you know, it's part of me. But there's so much more. So I love influencers and people in the media that are like that, like you said, like, they enforce a lifestyle, you know, being healthier, but also accepting yourself as you are and all these different things. It's not just, you know, I'm fat except me. That's it. You know, there's more to it than that. You know, it's funny that you say that, because like influencers, for example, like Ashley Graham, like if you see her eating healthy, that's nobody really says anything. But recently lizzo she posted up about, you know, doing a cleanse and eating healthy and people were attacking her, you know, because she was trying to do something healthy for her body. It's Do you, I feel like there's like a lose, what's the word I'm looking for? But like, you know, you're a big girl that makes her name out of being big and promoting positive body positivity decides to do something for herself. And people see it as, Oh, well. I thought you were all about pro body and body positivity. I just, I guess that's what I've been going back and forth in my head is they're trying. They're trying to promote body positivity in all body shapes. But if they're trying to do something good for themselves, people just attacking by saying, Oh, well, that's not body positive. Like keep eating your burgers girl. Like you don't need a cleanse. You still look good. I feel like that's a toxic comment. And that's what I'm trying to bring out in this episode. Um, Why think Liz? Oh, I think she she did the cleanse. She went vegan. I don't I follow her on Instagram and Tiktok. But I don't I don't know enough about why she did it. If it was for health reasons, or if it was more like a, you know, for animal rights or anything else, I'm not sure the reason behind it. But I do know that she was attacked in the media for that. And then, you know, you can be a bigger and still eat healthy, you know, I eat healthy most of the time, believe it or not. So it just, you know, and what she was doing was the same thing that she advocates, she advocates for self love taking care of yourself, doing things for yourself. And that's exactly what she did. You know, she felt like she needed to do something for her health, for her spirit. And that's why she chose to help, you know, to just change the way that she ate and what she was doing for herself. So I applaud that, you know whether she loses weight or not, or whatever the reasons for it. I buy That up, you know, because she did something for herself. And that's what she always stands for. And like Liz Oh, I like her to see the positive role model. At least in when I think of like, plus size. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. She's very like pro woman, you know, being an independent woman. And so I like that about her. And she even has like this application to be a model for her partner for me. Yeah, modeling for her. And it's like, she gives opportunities to all types of bodies and that's what I really love. But when it comes to Will you be applying for that spot on that? I know. I know me shy. Nah, you should you should I've seen videos or have like friends because the friends are shy or whatever, like friends that did the audition video for them and be like you should consider I'm gonna think about I should do you know not that great luck of yours. Talking about influencers? A big name that comes up in plus size is test holidaying. You know, this is another Well, this is an influencer that I'm always on the fence about, you know, I know that she was the first plus size model on, um, I was sitting with a magazine. She was the front cover girl for a magazine. And she was very criticized on it. Because she was very big. She's heavily tattooed. She's super small for a model. And I think she's like, five or 411 or something like that. No, she's actually we're the same height. I'm 540. She's fine. She was five, four. So she's actually not that short. Oh, I'm 540. So she's my model standard, I guess, models. So she's shorter than a model. She's bigger than a nor, like, bigger than the normal model for sure. Bigger than Ashley. Um, but I what I say on the fence with her is, I don't consider her like a good role model, in my opinion, for the plus size world. Why don't you consider her a good role model? Because she, unlike the other people that we've talked about, like lizzo, and Ashley, they advocate a healthy lifestyle. And yes, they're still plus size, but I see test doing photoshoots with burgers, or, you know, promoting controversy when it comes to binge eating. Um, just it's not the same kind of vibe that I get from all the other plus size influencers that we're speaking about. I get more of like she's promoting the bigness. This, but instead of promoting body positivity, which goes back to the first subject that we're talking about is like, are all bodies beautiful? Or are all bodies are healthy? You know, I think she thinks more of our bodies are beautiful. It doesn't matter what I put in my mouth when in reality, you know, deep down at the end of the day, it does matter what you put in your mouth. I mean, if we all ate burgers everyday, or really bad stuff every day, we'd all be really bad health. I mean, I'm sure the girl in the TV show my 600 pound life. You know? I'm sure they don't feel beautiful when they need to ask somebody for help to get out of the bed or need you know, listen, bream work, I cannot watch the show. I watch all the bad TV on TLC. But I cannot watch that show for two reasons. One, every time I watch my 600 pound life, I sit on my couch thinking oh my god because I maybe one day like am I gonna keep gaining weight and become one of the people on this show and then like messes with my head. And the second reason is that every woman on that show has a boyfriend. Every single one of them they can't leave my house but they have boyfriends. And every time I watch it, I'm like but what is wrong with me my boyfriend and other women on this show have boyfriends. But that's a whole nother subject day. That's part three, three. But you see what I mean? is is that lifestyle. Um, you know it my 600 pound life. You know, it's an extreme Dream, but it's an extreme. A lot of Americans go through, you know, it's not like an occasion like, I don't know, I noticed the rise in, you know how many contestants are and that contestants is not a team like that kind of show. But there's a lot of people that are extremely overweight, even if you go to Disney World, you see? And in no way shape or form, am I saying these people are not beautiful? Everyone is beautiful. I mean, like you say, there's beauties in the eye of the beholder. They are all married or have boyfriends. Exactly, exactly. So, now there's beauty in everyone. But um, I think also wanted to an extreme like that there's also either eating disorders involved, or mental health issues a lot of the time, you know, on that show, you see them, you know, where they have to go to therapy, and, you know, because to let something go to that point, there has to be a reason for it, you know, in the background. More than just medically, it's usually a mental health issue as well. Well, even with and I know a lot of plus size influencers or anybody online, will criticize. I don't know if you know who Eugenia cooney is she's an extremely skinny Twitch, she's a gamer on Twitch. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, I know who you're talking about. And people criticize her for being too thin, too thin that you can see her bones. Again, all bodies are beautiful. All bodies are healthy at any size. I mean, I'm just quoting what we're talking about. Um, but it's the same kind of mentality but flipped around, she finds herself looking great. And, you know, but people still criticize her for her weight. So no matter what, there's always going to be criticism, but it's about finding the healthy balance because for her, she has a lot of controversy online as people are saying that she should be banned. because she'll be live streaming for like 12 hours or eight hours straight. She never goes to the bathroom. She never eats she never drinks water. There was even if I remember correctly, a challenge called the Eugenia cooney challenge that people watch your streams and not eat or drink because you're trying to be like her. So that could affect minors, you know, cuz she was, you know, gamers are usually younger audience. So it could be the same thing with like, tests, younger girls looking up to tests and thinking shit, I can eat whatever I want, because I'm beautiful. See? So I feel like there's there's two extreme examples that I'm giving. And I feel like we share. A lot of the times when test does things like that. It's almost like in response, or she's trying to, I don't want to say bait the audience, but it's, it's almost in response to the attacks that she gets online because she does get a lot of negative comments and you know, people just be really mean to her. And I think that's almost like a, like people that laugh at themselves. Because I think people are gonna laugh at them kind of thing, where she does that because she's like, well, you think I'm gonna, I sit around eating bonbons all day. So, if that's what you think about me, here you go. That's how I feel sometimes just like because I follow her and what you know, looking at her feed, sometimes I'm like, Okay, here we go. You know, what is it going to be today? Because, you know, she was attacked by somebody but people are relentless in their commentaries. I like the things that they tell her. You like read her comments, like so mean, you know, it's just terrible. I haven't read her comments. I usually I've seen the Eugenia cooney ones. And her comments are mostly like, Oh, you know, you're so beautiful, but you're gonna die. You know, I'm sure test gets the same thing. Like, you're so beautiful, but you're so fat, you're gonna die. Um, I don't know, where the line reaches of people trying to intervene into people's lives. Like, I know that. When people say that sincerely, they mean it in the right, you know, you know, they these are fans of these girls, and they want to see them, you know? Well, but do you think in these two extreme examples, that it's difficult for these women to try to try to live a healthier lifestyle without losing their fame? I mean, test is known known for being fat. Eugenia is known for being skinny. I would think mentally Eugenia would be like, man, if I gain weight, because I've seen a lot of videos of people. A lot of negative attention for it, but it's still attention. Yes, no, it's still fame. It's still you know, no. notoriety for, for those reasons. So I think it would affect them in a way, just like lizzo. You know, like when she did like what we were talking about, she changed her diet, and she changed her lifestyle. And then people were criticizing her, because she was not gonna get skinny, which she hasn't gotten skinny. She's changed a little bit, but it's not like an overnight thing. Um, so I think it would affect them, you know, and they've made a career out of that. So, you know, it is something to think about. Because you no longer if she were to lose all this weight, she would no longer be the plus size model that may you know, so, like, look at the girl from what's the name of the movie of the girl. The girl said, harmonise. Rebel Wilson? Yes. She was like, a lot of weight, or losing weight. That doesn't make her a different person. She's still the same actress. But some people were saying she's not the same, you know? Well, look at all the roles that she played, she played the chubby bestfriend all the jokes were about her we, you know, it was like, that was part of the characters that she's played, at least the movies that I've seen her in. So she wouldn't be able to play the same roles because she's no longer there, Toby best friends, you know, they can poke fun on her for being the fat one or, you know, having double chin or whatever. So it does change. And it's going to affect her because like you said, like, people only know her as that role. I wonder, you know, what her next role is going to be and how it's going to define it's going to be difficult for her I could, you know, I would see just like Adele, right? Adele, you know, and it's so sad because they're trying to live, you know, they're trying to improve themselves at the end of the day. And yes, Adele was beautiful, then beautiful. Now it doesn't make her better. I hate the comments. I say, Oh, look at her now she's glowing. I'm like, I'm pretty sure she was going before. I mean, look at how many Yes. Wow. And all those pictures came out a few months ago. She was so thin. And everybody was like, She's so gorgeous. And I thought she was so incredibly gorgeous when she was plus size. I mean, I was obsessed with her look, because she kind of had kind of like that 60s vibe going. And I thought she was so beautiful. Like Never did I think while Adele she would lose some weight, she would look better. You know, I thought she was gorgeous as she was and then when she came out and that's all you heard in the media was, Oh, she looks so fantastic. But then like two weeks later, they're like, oh, adults getting too skinny. She's now too thin. And it's like, how do you win? You can't win with these people. Just like Grandma, like even grandma. You're either too fat or too skinny in between? Yes, like when you go to family get togethers. If you don't eat, they think oh, there's something wrong. You're not eating, you're gonna get too skinny. You're like, I want that and I walk away that opinion or the you know, you're getting fat Close your mouth. happens. It's true story. I'm sure. We've all been through. or ethnic. I've heard other as well. Well, it did take Jessica Simpson a few years ago. I forgot what year when she came out to do a chili cook off. And I think she will the size 10 and people said oh my gosh, she's so big. You know? And looking back at that is like when you're watching it. You think Yeah, she's got too big, but we've been conditioned by the media to think that she's gotten big. When in reality she was only a size 10 she looks good if you look at her now. You gorgeous Yeah, it's just the way it's seen, you know, Oh, she changed waiter. Oh, a doe last way. She must feel way better. Like now she could I'm like, bro, she's she went all those Grammys? I don't know. Yeah, the weights, I'm gonna affect her boys, you know, has nothing to do with that. It's so much pressure on on these actresses and models. Like, I can't imagine what that would be like to, to live under that scrutiny, you know that you gain two pounds and you're, you know, on the cover of a magazine because you gained two pounds or, you know, if you get too skinny. Like, that's just terrible. There's so much pressure just on the outside, when you really should be focusing on what's on the inside. Yeah, and what's in the inside doesn't change. I mean, if you're a nasty person, when you're skinny and you get fat, you're still a nasty person. Exactly. Your personality doesn't change, you know, exactly. I just don't know what we could all do. I mean, I know we can individually do to improve because, number one we should focus on, you know, letting people do what they want to you know, how can I say this? We could, I would think individually everyone take care of their health. Number one when it comes to celebrities, you know, Pick and choose if you're I would, I'm not a parent, but you have nieces and nephews, right? You would want him to look up to people or tell you hey, Vivian, like, look at this look at Tess holiday Look, it doesn't matter if I eat I get fat, I'm still gonna look good. How would that make you feel? Um, well, with my knees, we all you know, she's 10 years old. So she's in that age where she starts noticing her body. And she's feels very self conscious. And she looks around and you know, she's very tall for her age. Um, so she's like her the biggest one in her class. And she always looks around and thinks, you know, like, why am I different from everybody else. And so we always try to stress you know, that you're beautiful, you're unique, you're different. And we're all different, you know, that's what makes us special and beautiful. Um, she's still not looking so much at at different actresses or people like that, like as one person and saying, This is my role model, I look up to her collectively looking at different things. Um, but we do try to kind of steer her towards, you know, positive role models, and things like that. And even test, she might not be 100% positive role model. But there are things that I think that are positive about her. And she does try, I think she does try to, to bring out a positive message that she advocates are for the gay community, and she advocates for mental health issues, and things like that. I think I'm not sure if it was her personally, or her mom that suffered an abusive relationship. So she always also advocates for women to get support if they're in an abusive relationship and things like that. So there are positive things about her and, you know, maybe focusing on the positive. But I think that's a personal thing, you know, who think when will you have a role model or someone that you look up to, it's for a very personal reason, like, there's something about that person that kind of resonates with you. And that's why you look to them as somebody that you look up to. When I think of tests This is for all you plus a ladies you guys would understand. When I think of tests, I think of a comment that I get all the time that is Oh my god, you have such a beautiful face. But you're if you lost a little way, because most annoying comments. chubby girl can get Yeah, you know, a chubby girl never tell her never never if you're a man never do this to her. Never tell her Oh, you're so cute. If you lost a little more, or you have a cute face if he was a little way, you know? That's for you to be the perfect woman. If only you were thin. I got one from a guy. Yes. You'd be perfect. If only you were thin. Like really? Okay. Some people, some people, but I feel like test gets that a lot. Because when I was looking up stuff about or a lot, that comment came out so many times. And I'm here like you I feel like everybody gets this comment that's plus size. I think it's because you know, our beloved, she was so scared a little more extra plump in the face. So it gives us that little baby like, feature. We don't wrinkle as quickly. So how do you feel about how, you know, I know one thing I Another thing I do like about test holiday that I can't hate on is that she owns her sexuality when it comes to things. So, you know, I feel like it's such a weird mental state that we all have that like fat women are not sexy when fat women are sexy. And that's something on the next episode that I'm with you two weeks from now, because I want to let people soak in this. And marinate because as you can see, we both have like different opinions in this conversation. But it's a conversation that I feel like we need to have and to get ideas and I'm always about learning new things and seeing a new perspective. Because of now I'll just sit here in my room alone, just thinking all these thoughts. Staring at the beyond thinking all these things like test does show her sexuality which is something that I feel like we as you know, and I use fat and not a mean way because but I own it because I'm going to add that word doesn't offend me. Maybe When I was growing up, I heard the word fat. It was like, Oh, you know, but as an adult, you know, I'm, I've come to accept myself and love myself. And that's just part of who I am. It's not what you know, the only thing I am and it's the word doesn't bother me. I am fat. I am overweight, you know. Can't hide it. So, yeah. So beautiful. But yeah, so test, I feel like she does show the the sexual side, you know, which I really, I really appreciate just like Ashley, like she'll show herself breastfeeding her child. You know, that's a whole different subject about breastfeeding in public. I'm actually gonna have a few pinup moms come on the show in the future to talk about being a mom and different things. But being sexual shouldn't be just for skinny people or, or smart. No, absolutely not. But then you also have people that objectify but every genre has object objectification of sexuality. I'm sure there's men that love fat when you know, that's a, I would say that learning from a few episodes ago was Sarah. Yeah. It isn't a kink. You know, I feel like that's its own little world. And you would have to be like, she would say, consenting adults, you know, if you do want to participate in that kind of stuff, you know, there's women that feel like, well, if you know, I'm going to be with he's with me, because it's a fetish to him to be with a bigger woman, I have an issue with that. I personally don't have an issue with that. Because I think if you're gonna like me and find me beautiful, if that's your fetish, that's fine. If that's your kink, that's fine. If you just find me beautiful, that's fine, too. You know, so that personally, that's like, on a personal level, that doesn't bother me. Um, but yeah, it's like everything. There's preference, I have a preference as well, you know, and we all have our thing. We all we all have our type, right. So, yeah, that doesn't offend me, in the least. And that is what we're going to talk about. In the next episode that we're together, we're going to talk about, you know, dating and being big and bad. At JD it wasn't difficult enough. A good thing I'm not dating right now. But I, I've, I've dated a lot. So I have a lot to say in that episode. I'm sure you as well. And if you guys have anything to say, you know, make sure to text me or write it down below. And I'll say it in the episode. It's gonna be Episode 45. So next week, I have, we're going to take a little break from all the fatphobia influencers plus size, we're going to talk about pin up again. But this also revolves to pin up because in the pinup world, you know, it's more size inclusive now, in the vintage world with all these repot brands, and, you know, loving our bodies. So this is very prevalent to the pinup world. Um, but next week, I'm going to talk about pin tamper, I'm gonna have the two owners of pin tamper, come on to the show, and talk about the first meetup event in the west coast of Florida that I'm so excited to start, we started pin Tampa, in the middle of the pandemic. And finally, we're going to have the first event. So we're gonna talk about that. following week after that, we're going to talk about the continuation and dating and being plus size. And I really want to hear what you guys have to say, cuz me and Vivian, as you could see, we have so many thoughts and opinions about this topic. Um, and we just want to converse and bring it out. Do you have anything that you want to add or request? Well, definitely, if anybody you know, has any pointers for dating in current life situations, and you know, being plus size, I welcome him because I'm a single girl, and I'm struggling in the dating scene. So Vivian up some pointers. And definitely, you know, owning our sexuality. You touched on that subject, and I've been dying to dive into that, you know, when we've had these topics before, because it's so important, like you said, you know, just because we're overweight or plus size doesn't mean we're any less sexual than a thin woman. So absolutely, I think that's a great topic to touch on. So any pointers, any opinions, any ideas, bring them on? I'm so excited for that episode. podcast after dark You guys seem to be loving these subjects and I appreciate the feedback. But stay tuned guys, I look forward to this to hearing you what you guys have to say. I'm so excited. Thank you again one more time for listening in. And thank you, Vivian, for joining this week. It means the world to have you again. I'm so happy to be back and you'll be back again soon. Don't get too comfortable away from Alright guys, stay safe. Be happy. Love yourself.